Ethernet cables. Hidden problems?

This section is for any issues on setting up or configuring networks at home and small business.

Ethernet cables. Hidden problems?

Postby allen-uk » Tue 13 Feb, 2007 10:03 am

Hello.

Trying to connect G3 to iMac using an ethernet cable.

Cable fits both ends (I borrowed it from my cable modem, where it normally connects my G3 to the modem), but I'm having trouble establishing a network, and wondering whether the cable is right.

Apple talks about 'special crossover cables' and seems to differentiate it from a 'standard ethernet cable'.

Any cable experts around here?

Or, any networking experts, who may be able to suggest some 'obvious' points that all novices miss! (I shouldn't be a novice, but it is ten years or more since I played with networks and sharing, and you wouldn't believe how much I've forgotten).

Ta.

Allen.
UserAgent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.17; Mac_PowerPC)
allen-uk
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed 15 Nov, 2006 11:32 am
Location: london, UK

Postby Dr Lobster* » Tue 13 Feb, 2007 10:19 am

for this to work you will need either a cross-over cable or switch. the cheapest solutions is the cross over cable - you'll need a switch if you want to connect more than 2 devices together.

i'm not a mac user so i'm not sure of the os technicalities, but in the windows world you'll need to give each host a static ip on the same subnet (such as the 192.168.x range) and you should then have connection once you've connected the two devices together with a cross-over cable.

you can pick up a cross-over cable from your local pc world (or from misco etc) for just a couple of pounds: http://www.misco.co.uk/applications/Sea ... CatId=1773
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.1.1) Gecko/20061204 Firefox/2.0.0.1
Last edited by Dr Lobster* on Tue 13 Feb, 2007 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
Dr Lobster*
super member
super member
 
Posts: 164
Joined: Mon 29 May, 2006 3:46 pm
Location: Norfolk, UK

Re: Ethernet cables. Hidden problems?

Postby Antony » Tue 13 Feb, 2007 10:21 am

allen-uk wrote:Hello.

Trying to connect G3 to iMac using an ethernet cable.

Cable fits both ends (I borrowed it from my cable modem, where it normally connects my G3 to the modem), but I'm having trouble establishing a network, and wondering whether the cable is right.

Apple talks about 'special crossover cables' and seems to differentiate it from a 'standard ethernet cable'.

Any cable experts around here?

Or, any networking experts, who may be able to suggest some 'obvious' points that all novices miss! (I shouldn't be a novice, but it is ten years or more since I played with networks and sharing, and you wouldn't believe how much I've forgotten).

Ta.

Allen.
Thanks to Apple's modern Macs. You should be able to use standard Ethernet cable to connect two Macs directly. (however, I am not sure if it works with an old Mac.)

It is always safe to use a Crossover Cable (shouldn't be that expensive).

I would suggest you connect both your G3 and iMac to the router (if your router has more than one port).

If you want to connect two Macs directly (direct connection), you can, however, you will need to enable both your Macs, name them, and allow one to see another. (It shouldn't be matter which way round, as you can grab files from one or dump(*) from another one.
(*) dump means make a copy, not throwing out.

In short: Make sure you give your G3 and iMac two different names, and it might be a good idea to enable AppleTalk on both. Then, from Finder > Go > Connect to Server if it is not on the list, type in the name.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X; en-US; rv:1.8.1.1) Gecko/20061204 Firefox/2.0.0.1
User avatar
Antony
diamond member
diamond member
 
Posts: 15261
Joined: Tue 18 Jun, 2002 11:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Postby allen-uk » Tue 13 Feb, 2007 11:07 am

Thanks Dr.L, Antony.

Antony: I haven't got a router, or I don't think I have anyway!

I only want to connect the G3 to the iMac for a day or two, then disconnect for ever, so I'll see if I can get that crossover cable that Dr L gives the link for.

It may be that my problem is as simple as that. I've been through all the documentation from Apple on setting up sharing etc., and it doesn't go, so maybe it's as simple as the cable being wrong.

I'll keep you posted.

Allen.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02
allen-uk
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed 15 Nov, 2006 11:32 am
Location: london, UK

Ethernet crossover cable

Postby PaulD » Thu 15 Feb, 2007 12:54 am

The computer communication's port basically has two data lines, send and receive.
[tt]|----- send -----
|---- receive ---
[/tt] If multiple computers are going into a hub (or switch or router) the hub (etc.) takes care of the proper 'polarity' of signals. A 'normal' cable has the internal lines connected 'straight-through' - pin 1 on one end to pin 1 on the other, etc.

But if two computers are connected directly to each other, then a 'cross-over' cable is required in order keep signals happy. That is, the Send on each computer must be connected to the Receive on the other computer.

A 'cross-over' cable has the internal lines cross connected on one of the connecters.

This is independent of operating system or brand of hardware. It is basic electrical signal 'polarity'. (I put polarity in quotation marks because in reality it is somewhat more complex, but the basic concept is the same.)

I picked the first item in a Google search for [ "crossover cable" internet ]. It gives a better explanation, along with a colored diagram and actual connections.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.9) Gecko/20061206 Firefox/1.5.0.9
PaulD
diamond member
diamond member
 
Posts: 908
Joined: Mon 14 Aug, 2006 5:52 pm

Postby allen-uk » Thu 15 Feb, 2007 3:50 am

Thanks for that, PaulD. I'd already gone up the road to Maplin and bought a crossover cable (only £5) just to eliminate that from the major problems I was experiencing. Didn't solve the problem, either!

Anyway, at that point I phoned Apple support, and the guy there was an absolute genius. Knew iMac backwards, but also had a very good knowledge of G3/G4, 8.6, 9.0, etc.

And contrary to the bumf that Apple publish, it AIN'T easy making a network between an ancient classic Mac and an intel iMac. It took us about an hour, on the phone, to get it established, and even then it's only one way - G3 to iMac - but it works well, and I'll soon get all my data transferred, then I can put the cable in the drawer and forget all I've just learnt.

Thanks for the help.

Different problems later...


Allen.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02
allen-uk
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed 15 Nov, 2006 11:32 am
Location: london, UK

Postby Antony » Thu 15 Feb, 2007 6:44 pm

allen-uk wrote:Thanks for that, PaulD. I'd already gone up the road to Maplin and bought a crossover cable (only £5) just to eliminate that from the major problems I was experiencing. Didn't solve the problem, either!

Anyway, at that point I phoned Apple support, and the guy there was an absolute genius. Knew iMac backwards, but also had a very good knowledge of G3/G4, 8.6, 9.0, etc.

And contrary to the bumf that Apple publish, it AIN'T easy making a network between an ancient classic Mac and an intel iMac. It took us about an hour, on the phone, to get it established, and even then it's only one way - G3 to iMac - but it works well, and I'll soon get all my data transferred, then I can put the cable in the drawer and forget all I've just learnt.
Good to know the transferring of your data has been taken cared of.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X; en-US; rv:1.8.1.1) Gecko/20061204 Firefox/2.0.0.1
User avatar
Antony
diamond member
diamond member
 
Posts: 15261
Joined: Tue 18 Jun, 2002 11:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia


Return to Home and Business Networking

Who is online

Registered users: Baidu [Spider], Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Yahoo [Bot]