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Pu7o
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 1978
Location: Portugal
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 21 Feb, 2005 4:44 pm |
[sdp=53192] |
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yes, but having netscape default to IE, even if only on trusted sites, is really bad... probably most webpages will be:
| Quote: | 
Best rendered with Microsoft Internet Explorer or Netscape 8. If using Netscape 8, please set this website as trusted.
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UserAgent: Kidzilla/0.1 (Linux x86; Firefox 1.1 CVS) (Gecko, like MSIE 6.0) |
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Umachines
Valdimir Altuve
Joined: 13 Dec 2004
Posts: 9
Location: Venezuela
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| 23 Feb, 2005 8:53 am |
[sdp=53292] |
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Hi again!. I got the pre-beta from some eastern site  . I like the new theme, It's more 'Netscape', you know. One of the best improvements is the rendering engine manager; I still think this is the best feature for an eventual release, and I see the development team is focusing on this too. Another important feature is the form manager, I just discovered it while making this post itself. On the other hand, I feel the theme interface a bit slow, when switching tabs, maximizing, etc. Test the browser in a Celeron(not Prescott)/Duron system to see my point. But this one is more than I expected after proto2.
Netscape 8 can turn in the browser for advanced users. This can be good or bad, depending on marketing strategy.
Saludos, guys!
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20050217 Firefox/0.9.4 |
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Hendikins
Joined: 26 Aug 2002
Posts: 615
Location: All stations to Zig Zag via the North Shore Line
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| 23 Feb, 2005 9:20 pm |
[sdp=53342] |
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Rant
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.8b) Gecko/20050215
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Antony
Joined: 18 Jun 2002
Posts: 12751
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| 23 Feb, 2005 10:20 pm |
[sdp=53343] |
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| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why can I not have separate reload and stop buttons? This is perhaps my most hated “feature” in Opera… |
There's not separate reload and stop buttons in our beloved Safari. Use keys.
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why did you break the ability to add additional search engines to the search box? |
Officially, you can't add search engines to our beloved Safari. Why do you want to break all the settings?
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why are the Go button and URL bar combined? |
What's wrong with that?
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you insist on trying to break themes and extensions, which are one of the main reasons people have switched to Firefox in the first place? (and why do you still link to update.mozilla.org to get them?) |
What's themes and extensions for Firefox or Mozilla to do with this? So they can't place a link? You have the privilege to block them, if you are so unhappy about that.
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you persist in linking to my site from about:plugins? |
I am sure you know how to ask them to remove that link, or again, you can block all accesses from about:plugins, just like you block every ads but surprisingly you added more ads for Netscape.
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Where’s the rebranded Thunderbird? |
What's Netscape 8 got to do with Thunderbird?
Who said they must use Thunderbird?
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/125.5.6 (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/125.12
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Hendikins
Joined: 26 Aug 2002
Posts: 615
Location: All stations to Zig Zag via the North Shore Line
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| 24 Feb, 2005 6:56 am |
[sdp=53354] |
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| Antony wrote: |
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why can I not have separate reload and stop buttons? This is perhaps my most hated “feature” in Opera… |
There's not separate reload and stop buttons in our beloved Safari. Use keys.
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Why should I need to? This is poor UI design, and it breaks convention.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why did you break the ability to add additional search engines to the search box? |
Officially, you can't add search engines to our beloved Safari. Why do you want to break all the settings? |
So wishing to use the functionality for the purpose it was designed for is breaking settings?
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why are the Go button and URL bar combined? |
What's wrong with that?
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I wish to save some of my screen real estate by removing a button that I don't use, and can remove in virtually every other browser. What's wrong with that?
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you insist on trying to break themes and extensions, which are one of the main reasons people have switched to Firefox in the first place? (and why do you still link to update.mozilla.org to get them?) |
What's themes and extensions for Firefox or Mozilla to do with this? So they can't place a link? You have the privilege to block them, if you are so unhappy about that. |
The product is based on Firefox. The link is in chrome.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you persist in linking to my site from about:plugins? |
I am sure you know how to ask them to remove that link, or again, you can block all accesses from about:plugins, just like you block every ads but surprisingly you added more ads for Netscape. |
I'm sure I could block all access where referrer is about:plugins and useragent is <insert Netscape 8 final useragent here>. Am I going to? No.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Where’s the rebranded Thunderbird? |
What's Netscape 8 got to do with Thunderbird?
Who said they must use Thunderbird? |
This product is intended to replace the suite. Where's the complete set of replacement parts?
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.8b) Gecko/20050215
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Antony
Joined: 18 Jun 2002
Posts: 12751
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| 24 Feb, 2005 7:09 am |
[sdp=53355] |
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| Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: |
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why can I not have separate reload and stop buttons? This is perhaps my most hated “feature” in Opera… |
There's not separate reload and stop buttons in our beloved Safari. Use keys.
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Why should I need to? This is poor UI design, and it breaks convention. |
convention? What convention? The convention that Firefox is trying to borrow from our beloved Safari?
| Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why did you break the ability to add additional search engines to the search box? |
Officially, you can't add search engines to our beloved Safari. Why do you want to break all the settings? |
So wishing to use the functionality for the purpose it was designed for is breaking settings? |
So everything must back to Mozilla Central? Ridiculous.
| Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why are the Go button and URL bar combined? |
What's wrong with that?
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I wish to save some of my screen real estate by removing a button that I don't use, and can remove in virtually every other browser. What's wrong with that? |
Haven't you saved a lot from breaking many web page designs by using a number of combinations?
| Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you insist on trying to break themes and extensions, which are one of the main reasons people have switched to Firefox in the first place? (and why do you still link to update.mozilla.org to get them?) |
What's themes and extensions for Firefox or Mozilla to do with this? So they can't place a link? You have the privilege to block them, if you are so unhappy about that. |
The product is based on Firefox. The link is in chrome. |
Then you should blame to the chrome who put a link for browsers not satisfying your requirement.
| Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you persist in linking to my site from about:plugins? |
I am sure you know how to ask them to remove that link, or again, you can block all accesses from about:plugins, just like you block every ads but surprisingly you added more ads for Netscape. |
I'm sure I could block all access where referrer is about:plugins and useragent is <insert Netscape 8 final useragent here>. Am I going to? No. |
See above.
| Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Where’s the rebranded Thunderbird? |
What's Netscape 8 got to do with Thunderbird?
Who said they must use Thunderbird? |
This product is intended to replace the suite. Where's the complete set of replacement parts? |
Who told you that the product is intended to replace the suite?
And if so, why must be Thunderbird?
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/125.5.6 (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/125.12
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Hendikins
Joined: 26 Aug 2002
Posts: 615
Location: All stations to Zig Zag via the North Shore Line
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| 24 Feb, 2005 9:23 am |
[sdp=53359] |
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| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: |
| Hendikins wrote: | | * Why can I not have separate reload and stop buttons? This is perhaps my most hated “feature” in Opera… |
There's not separate reload and stop buttons in our beloved Safari. Use keys.
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Why should I need to? This is poor UI design, and it breaks convention. |
convention? What convention? The convention that Firefox is trying to borrow from our beloved Safari? |
The convention of Back/Forward/Reload/Stop - which goes back what, 10 years?
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why did you break the ability to add additional search engines to the search box? |
Officially, you can't add search engines to our beloved Safari. Why do you want to break all the settings? |
So wishing to use the functionality for the purpose it was designed for is breaking settings? |
So everything must back to Mozilla Central? Ridiculous. |
The product (and as a result, the functionality) is based on Firefox. Merely linking to an explaination of what it is there for.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why are the Go button and URL bar combined? |
What's wrong with that?
|
I wish to save some of my screen real estate by removing a button that I don't use, and can remove in virtually every other browser. What's wrong with that? |
Haven't you saved a lot from breaking many web page designs by using a number of combinations? |
Filtering ads doesn't de-clutter my browser UI.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you insist on trying to break themes and extensions, which are one of the main reasons people have switched to Firefox in the first place? (and why do you still link to update.mozilla.org to get them?) |
What's themes and extensions for Firefox or Mozilla to do with this? So they can't place a link? You have the privilege to block them, if you are so unhappy about that. |
The product is based on Firefox. The link is in chrome. |
Then you should blame to the chrome who put a link for browsers not satisfying your requirement. |
Chrome == browser UI in this case. A 1 line change to an XML file (or is it a Javascript file? Can't remember...) is all that is required. Of course, I'm probably not allowed to do it myself, because of some decompiling clause in the EULA or something.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Why do you persist in linking to my site from about:plugins? |
I am sure you know how to ask them to remove that link, or again, you can block all accesses from about:plugins, just like you block every ads but surprisingly you added more ads for Netscape. |
I'm sure I could block all access where referrer is about:plugins and useragent is <insert Netscape 8 final useragent here>. Am I going to? No. |
See above.
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Again, a 1 line fix to the program. My site is a community resource, not an official one, so either make it official (and pay me for working on it), indicate that it is an unofficial/community resource, or don't link to it.
| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | * Where’s the rebranded Thunderbird? |
What's Netscape 8 got to do with Thunderbird?
Who said they must use Thunderbird? |
This product is intended to replace the suite. Where's the complete set of replacement parts? |
Who told you that the product is intended to replace the suite?
And if so, why must be Thunderbird? |
Why would it be called Netscape 8 if it wasn't intended to replace Netscape 7?
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.8b) Gecko/20050215
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Don_HH2K
Joined: 09 May 2004
Posts: 4745
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| 24 Feb, 2005 10:09 am |
[sdp=53363] |
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| Hendikins wrote: | | The convention of Back/Forward/Reload/Stop - which goes back what, 10 years? |
Further. It was in Lynx or whatever my family were using in 1989 with The World's shell access on a VT100 emulator.
OK, personally, I have to agree with Hendikins here. I don't like the fact that they've ditched the two standalone Stop/Reload buttons and merged them into one. What if I want to reload while a page is still loading? Click twice, not once. OK, that isn't too bad unless I was some new extreme of lazy, but still you have to. As well, search engines should be able to be added, the Go button and search bar should be able to be taken out, and I do wish that there was a rebranded edition of Thunderbird.
...but, that's just me speaking.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.0; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Donzilla/0.6b (like Netscape/7.2)
Laptop: Turion 64 X2 @ 2GHz, 2GB DDR2-667, 100GB HD, ATI Radeon X300, 15" LCD, Seven Ultimate RC |
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James
Joined: 12 Jul 2002
Posts: 1746
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| 24 Feb, 2005 10:22 am |
[sdp=53365] |
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I've a few questions based upon some of Antony's remarks.
- will Netscape 8 have an email client or will it be solely a browser?
- will Netscape 8 contain patches to all the vulnerabilities found by Secunia that currently renders earlier versions of Netscape (i.e. 7.2) unsafe for browsing?
- who exactly is funding this new browser and for what purposes?
- has there been any long-range plans for Netscape revealed to date or is this simply a one-time development and we'll need to "stayed tuned" to see what develops (if anything)?
Thanks.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041107 Firefox/1.0
James
It's later than you think.
Firefox 3.5.3, IE 8 |
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Andrew T.
Joined: 14 Mar 2003
Posts: 1229
Location: Somewhere beyond the sea
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| 24 Feb, 2005 10:27 am |
[sdp=53367] |
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I must say that Hendikins makes some very good points, and I agree with most of his concerns and complaints.
I would mention some problems of my own I have with Netscape 8.0 pre-beta software, but most of them have already been mentioned already, so I will refrain.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041107 Firefox/1.0 |
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Fulvio
Joined: 19 Jun 2002
Posts: 11048
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| 24 Feb, 2005 12:31 pm |
[sdp=53378] |
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| James wrote: |
- will Netscape 8 have an email client or will it be solely a browser?
- will Netscape 8 contain patches to all the vulnerabilities found by Secunia that currently renders earlier versions of Netscape (i.e. 7.2) unsafe for browsing?
- who exactly is funding this new browser and for what purposes?
- has there been any long-range plans for Netscape revealed to date or is this simply a one-time development and we'll need to "stayed tuned" to see what develops (if anything)?
Thanks. |
1.Netscape8 will be based on Firefox, which is just a browser, and it has a link to the default mail.
2. I can't think of any patches ever issued. It is a new thing or nothing.
3. AOL is contracting the work out, but I am not sure why. AOL had been developing a browser only program, based on IE. I tested, and it did not go anywhere, by itself, but had a number of features found in the gecko based programs. AOL, also, had worked on an external mail application, called AOL Communicator. Then, they went from that program which talked to Netscape, to another, forgettable, mail client, which was talking to Outlook or Outlook Express.
AOL is lousy as a browser, and AOL users use IE, and many people use OUtlook or Outlook Express, so you should see the point.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041107 Firefox/1.0 (ax)
"I've got a very poor sense of direction. I keep forgetting which way is forwards."
WinXP, SP3, 512 MB, 3.0.15 regular, 3.5.5 regular and portable , TB2.0.0.23, Flock2.5.2, IE8.0, SM2.0, Google Chrome2.0.x, Safari4.0.4, Zone Alarm; AVG9.0, JRE1.6_17 |
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Antony
Joined: 18 Jun 2002
Posts: 12751
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| 24 Feb, 2005 3:54 pm |
[sdp=53399] |
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| Hendikins wrote: | | The convention of Back/Forward/Reload/Stop - which goes back what, 10 years? |
And once it was there, they aren't allowed to improve it or redesign?
| Hendikins wrote: | | The product (and as a result, the functionality) is based on Firefox. Merely linking to an explaination of what it is there for. |
And once you legally borrowed something from Mozilla or Firefox, you must stuck with it for the rest of the product's life? They are not allowed to design or implement something of their own?
| Hendikins wrote: | | Filtering ads doesn't de-clutter my browser UI. |
That's more of unethical issue involved.
Now, not just ads you are blocking (translate, ripping websites), you also want to destroy the browser interface?
| Hendikins wrote: | | Chrome == browser UI in this case. A 1 line change to an XML file (or is it a Javascript file? Can't remember...) is all that is required. Of course, I'm probably not allowed to do it myself, because of some decompiling clause in the EULA or something. |
I know what chrome is. I am pretty sure you know how to get things changes.
| Hendikins wrote: | | Again, a 1 line fix to the program. My site is a community resource, not an official one, so either make it official (and pay me for working on it), indicate that it is an unofficial/community resource, or don't link to it. |
What is your point? Are you really not happy Netscape linked to your site? Of if there's a requirement to link to your site? Please make it clear.
| Hendikins wrote: | | Why would it be called Netscape 8 if it wasn't intended to replace Netscape 7? |
Not necessary. To replace Netscape 7 does not indicate they must use Thunderbird. They own the name Netscape, they are free to call it Netscape 8.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/125.5.6 (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/125.12
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Andrew T.
Joined: 14 Mar 2003
Posts: 1229
Location: Somewhere beyond the sea
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| 24 Feb, 2005 3:57 pm |
[sdp=53400] |
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| Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | The convention of Back/Forward/Reload/Stop - which goes back what, 10 years? |
And once it was there, they aren't allowed to improve it or redesign?. |
I hardly consider deviating from this convention to be an improvement.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041107 Firefox/1.0 |
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Antony
Joined: 18 Jun 2002
Posts: 12751
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| 24 Feb, 2005 5:02 pm |
[sdp=53405] |
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| Andrew T. wrote: | | Antony wrote: | | Hendikins wrote: | | The convention of Back/Forward/Reload/Stop - which goes back what, 10 years? |
And once it was there, they aren't allowed to improve it or redesign?. |
I hardly consider deviating from this convention to be an improvement. |
Combining Reload and Stop is nothing new, it was there during the early preview release of Netscape Communicator.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/125.5.6 (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/125.12
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Don_HH2K
Joined: 09 May 2004
Posts: 4745
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| 24 Feb, 2005 5:10 pm |
[sdp=53407] |
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| Antony wrote: | | Combining Reload and Stop is nothing new, it was there during the early preview release of Netscape Communicator. |
Which version of Communicator? I think I used all of the 4.0 betas, was it the 4.5 betas (since I didn't have 95 to run them)? If it was indeed such a topic in the betas, then it should be a sign that they probably received negative feedback on such, and probably wouldn't want to do so again.
UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Donzilla/0.6PR1 (like Netscape/7.2; wml/1.3)
Laptop: Turion 64 X2 @ 2GHz, 2GB DDR2-667, 100GB HD, ATI Radeon X300, 15" LCD, Seven Ultimate RC |
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